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Motty
| 10 Feb '09 12:56 : 0 recs
violent crimes. what is the cause?
a. overdosage of alc.
b. economy
c. no sports like baseball but lady like sports, such as crickot something.
i think, c. |
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3dc
| 21 Oct '08 03:42 : 0 recs
Alice and the rabbit are drinking tea little c.
Real men are drinking beer and watching baseball or US football. |
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little c
| 06 Oct '08 10:08 : 0 recs
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Motty
| 26 Aug '08 17:08 : 0 recs
and people are getting more mad for falling house prices..... |
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PaxAm
| 23 Apr '07 14:31 : 0 recs : edited 3 times : last edit 23 Apr '07 14:49
As the snow flies
On a cold and gray chicago mornin
A poor little baby child is born
In the ghetto
And his mama cries
cause if theres one thing that she dont need
Its another hungry mouth to feed
In the ghetto
People, dont you understand
The child needs a helping hand
Or hell grow to be an angry young man some day
Take a look at you and me,
Are we too blind to see,
Do we simply turn our heads
And look the other way
Well the world turns
And a hungry little boy with a runny nose
Plays in the street as the cold wind blows
In the ghetto
And his hunger burns
So he starts to roam the streets at night
And he learns how to steal
And he learns how to fight
In the ghetto
Then one night in desperation
A young man breaks away
He buys a gun, steals a car,
Tries to run, but he dont get far
And his mama cries
As a crowd gathers round an angry young man
Face down on the street with a gun in his hand
In the ghetto
As her young man dies,
On a cold and gray chicago mornin,
Another little baby child is born
In the ghetto
Ah - if only it were so simple Elvis - thank you very much - uhuh. I'l be here till Saturday. Try the buffet - that green and orange stuff is suprisingly tasty. |
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Merlin
| 16 Apr '07 17:28 : 0 recs
Hampstead is a ghetto. |
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ssaines
| 16 Apr '07 15:44 : 0 recs
Ghetto:Originally, the section of a European city to which Jews were restricted. Today, commonly defined as a section of a city occupied by members of a minority group who live there because of social restrictions on their residential choice.
There are a number of definitions at the url following, all mentioning the social aspect:
Definitions of Ghetto on the Web: |
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Warren BuffetCar
| 16 Apr '07 15:31 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 16 Apr '07 15:33
agnostic,
Somehow, we have to unwind all the mistakes made in the intervening years. Certainly one of the problems has been "ghettoisation" - the evolution of near-solid ethnic communities whose first alleigance is to their ethnicity (or, in the case of Muslims, their religion). That is one crux of the problem. No matter how evil a person, no matter what he has done, if he is of your own close community, you don't hand him over to the authorities, do you? And so those communities have to ask themselves what they should do instead ...
It's too late to split up the ghettos. Besides, with the right attitudes, they can work - look at almost any Chinatown. But rules and an ethos have to be established. It should be the aim that anyone has the right to walk any street in Britain without feeling threatened, or even tacitly "excluded".
Ghettos aren't a problem per se. As you point out, China town is a ghetto of chinese people, but that doesn't have the same implication as talking about other ghettos.
Its perfectly natural for people to choose to live with their own kind. Brits do this overseas (take for example the large British enclaves in Southern Spain). In many cases they buy from British shops, drink in British bars and get their car fixed by a British mechanic.
People shouldn't get hung up because immigrants may choose to live in communities together where they can easily buy their food, listen to their music, watch their movies etc.
As to people having the right to "feel safe in Brixton" you can't give this right. Some people will feel unsafe purely because they are surrounded by people of a different colour. Some areas with large black populations are very dangerous. However, even before this immigration many of these areas (or other areas) that housed poor working class white people were also dangerous.
This isn't political correctness. Black areas have particular criminal problems, especially with regard to robbery and gun crime, that should be acknowledged before it is tackled. I happen to agree with the view that the breakdown of the family unit in west indian communities (for whatever reason) is to blame in a large part.
But "ghettos" aren't a problem - there are deprived white areas of the country that have appalling crime problems, at the same time there are areas with high ethnic populations that don't have these problems.
Attempting to destroy ghettos is social engineering. You either have to displace people by force, or use social engineering in the form of grants, funding etc to disperse them. Will this include dispersing rich eastern europeans from Chelsea, or does it only apply to poorer immigrants?
WBC |
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Merlin
| 16 Apr '07 10:00 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 16 Apr '07 10:15
''Merlin:
I don't, actually, disagree with you.
The paradox is that political correctness and the fear of being branded racist are deeply ingrained in the worst ghettos, though the definitions may be turned on their heads.''
Quite
''you cannot tell me not to stab people cos that makes you a racist''
bollocks.
'' You behave yourself sonny or you will be sold to the next arab slave trader''-has a good deterrant effect.
And before the pinko fringe get excited there is nothing racist in that at all - black or white we do not want these ill behaved people in our nice country-they can all go. What determines whether you can stay is how you behave- same for everyone. |
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Merlin
| 16 Apr '07 09:57 : 0 recs
''US Blacks are ten times as likely to be the victims of murder than whites.''
All negroid people the world over have been more likely to suffer violence and murder than white people.- particularly in Africa.
The fact that they are in USA is irrelevant. |
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zorro
| 16 Apr '07 08:42 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 16 Apr '07 08:42
The Government is now seemingly advocating two new education policies (any fule kno that new policies are the last thing this country needs), ie:
1. dish out praise to criticism in 4/1 ratio; and
2. bribe pupils for NOT misbehaving. The idea of offering IPods is being looked at.
Brilliant thinking.
An example of 1., I suppose, goes something like:
You were very quick off you feet for the overweight boy that you are, Wayne, to swing that punch at Kevin. And you got him smack in the gob - well done again! The kick in the groin, which you performed without falling over, showed your good sense of balance, even though you seem to be under the influence of some illegal substance. And the use of the phrase 'Am I bovvered?', when challenged, demonstrates your active ability to employ the register appropriate for the occasion, in this case - rhetorical speech. It is a shame though, that you are fighting in class, which is not allowed.
As for 2. above, I am putting myself up for the IPod, on the promise that I will not punch the minister for education in the nose, even though I am much tempted.
Where do I collect? I hope that I am not going to be discriminated against on the grounds of being a retired teacher. |
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ssaines
| 15 Apr '07 17:41 : 0 recs
The problem isn't race, like Blair is calling it. It is *Social*!!!
US Blacks are ten times as likely to be the victims of murder than whites.
Is that racial or social? |
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agnostic
| 15 Apr '07 17:16 : 0 recs
Merlin:
I don't, actually, disagree with you.
The paradox is that political correctness and the fear of being branded racist are deeply ingrained in the worst ghettos, though the definitions may be turned on their heads. |
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Merlin
| 15 Apr '07 16:56 : 0 recs
I don't agree.
Today's criminal behaviour is spawned by a combination of political correctness and fear of being branded racist.
Our Police should deal with crime without regard to colour and stop it happening.
The job of a police force is to prevent crime- not record it or measure it or write it on forms- it is to stop it happening in the first place.
That was Sir Robert Peel's requirement and it has not changed.
Our present police forces are utterly failing in this. |
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ssaines
| 15 Apr '07 14:38 : 0 recs : edited 2 times : last edit 15 Apr '07 14:55
Agnostic: Yes! I feared that perhaps the point would be lost. I was rather gruff last night, Blair really got under my skin, so to speak. It is far from being just the UK that fails to understand the rainbow of cultures that come under the "Black" banner.
That is both Zorro and yourself now who recognize that it is a *specific group* within the "Black" community that is the cause of almost all the problems.
And that is Blair's blunder. It is like blaming all Europeans for the ravages of Hitler. (albeot the comparison lacks linearity).
Trinidadians are an interesting study, and there are four distinct communities within the island...not even counting the Whites!
Jamaica is a very stratified island, with a pecking order some six or so layers deep, much of it depending on how 'black' one's appearance is. I'm told this by Jamaican friends, and it permeates their politics as well as culture.
It is a complex issue, and not that abstract when compared to other cultures, our own included. The various Chinese cultures worship light skin as well, or at least did in previous cultural manifestations. Only labourers exposed themselves to the sun.
Speaking of the Chinese, they too are a very diverse *group* of people, not a race. There are six major language groups on the mainland alone, and almost all of them representing different peoples. My ear recognized a Taiwanese dialect in the Mandarin spoken yesterday by some customers at work. Rofl...I had a Taiwanese landlord some years back, and we used to discuss language and culture extensively. Taiwan hosts three languages alone. Taiwanese, Ha'ka (the language that was exported by migrants from the Mainland, Singapore being an example) and a language of the original inhabitants of the island, now only found in the mountains.
Said customers were astounded that I could tell the difference without speaking Mandarin (which of course is the only commonality that binds China together), but in the Taiwanese Mandarin, certain consonants in fact are pronounced....ta da...'"Ha'Ka". It is a gutteral inflection from the back of the throat.
But getting back to Blair's comments, understanding what Zorro and you do, then it is easy to see why so many Blacks were deeply offended by Blair's remarks.
The damage is immense, and you don't have to be Black to realize how stupid and uninformed they were.
The man has a mouth that he can fit many feet into at once, not just his own.
There are many Black societies that are wonderful, gentle people. As rough as I must appear to be at times, I find that their *children* display this more than any other facet. I envy some Black folks for their manners and decorum, and Sunday School (as much as I'm a Heathen) shows them dressed in their 'Sunday finest'...and I'm impressed that these folks need protection and to be understood, not to be lambasted.
As for the troublemakers? Call a spade a Spade, but leave the upstanding Black folks alone, other than to help them rid the problem in their midst. or at least deal with it on a specific basis. They are the victims more than Whitey.
Btw: Those Black churches? I may not be a full Believer in God, but I must say, these folks know how to 'praise' the Lord with music. They *celebrate* it. It has been more than a few times that parishioners have caught me outside listening intently to their wondrous singing, listening in envy, and bathing in the wholesomeness of it all. Many timnes I've been invited in to join them...and sadly, as much as I love to play, I have declined.
It has made me many friends though. They appreciate that they are appreciated, which is as human as you can get.
And yes, I get smiles on the street to this day when we pass each other.
Just one of those deep, wonderful associations of spirit I guess. These are very good people. They must be protected and helped.
And Geez, I guess that's MY Sunday Sermon!
Rdit: And yes, the Guyanese. Even within Guyana (where there is still a Carib population, btw) there are fractious divisions, so the few miles that separate Guyana (British) from Trinidad are not surprising in terms of pecking order and social exclusion.
Guyana is an interesting study is complete economic and political mismanagement. It was a jewel at one time, and the Indo/Paki inhabitants who constitute one group (fractious within itself) actually lament the Empire days, when a railroad ran and Guyana exported to the World. Now they export inhabitants. |
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agnostic
| 15 Apr '07 11:18 : 0 recs : edited 2 times : last edit 15 Apr '07 11:22
There are factions even within the West Indian community, more subtle than most of us might imagine.
Many years ago, a charming Trinidadian colleague of mine married a fellow West Indian, a guy I accepted as gentle, intelligent and hard working. Her family boycotted the wedding. He came from Guyana, you see ...
Compared with this, the gulf between the West Indians and the West Africans is yawning, as Zorro implies.
And all those years ago, another colleague - a highly capable Jamaican statistician - complained about "the scum of Kingston" taking over Brixton and Streatham. We liberal Whities thought she was wildly exaggerating.
Somehow, we have to unwind all the mistakes made in the intervening years. Certainly one of the problems has been "ghettoisation" - the evolution of near-solid ethnic communities whose first alleigance is to their ethnicity (or, in the case of Muslims, their religion). That is one crux of the problem. No matter how evil a person, no matter what he has done, if he is of your own close community, you don't hand him over to the authorities, do you? And so those communities have to ask themselves what they should do instead ...
It's too late to split up the ghettos. Besides, with the right attitudes, they can work - look at almost any Chinatown. But rules and an ethos have to be established. It should be the aim that anyone has the right to walk any street in Britain without feeling threatened, or even tacitly "excluded". The problem with the black hoodlums of some parts of south London is that they can so easily present themselves as an alternative form of "security". "We don't want the police pokin' their noses in here. We can take care of things, innit." And I suspect that some of the recent atrocities have been conducted on exactly those grounds.
But we have all seen what ethnically (or religiously) based "local security" can lead to, in places as diverse as Northern Ireland and Iraq. Just for starters, therefore, all communities need to accept the existence of a national, secular rule of law. And as a starter for that starter, communities could stop condemning their members who join the police as sellouts and traitors. But will they? |
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Merlin
| 15 Apr '07 10:46 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 15 Apr '07 10:49
And since I'm in a pokey mood, Merlin, how in the hell can you lambaste me for taking other posters to task when you post absolutely racist diatribe drivel?
I think you are referring to the following
''My own view favours atonement for slavery. Every time one of these little sods misbehaves send them to the west coast of Africa as a slave for a quid. That we repay our debts and solve a problem''
Nothing racist about selling gun and knife criminals of any colour. I don't care about their race. I don't want criminals of any colour or creed here being a bloody nuisance.
I do so find it very wet to see the racism card waved wrongly all the time- thats one of the main reasons we have the problems we have - picking on these people is not racist a killer is a killer. You don't let him off because his folks came from Jamaica or anywhere else. |
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ssaines
| 15 Apr '07 03:51 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 15 Apr '07 04:07
I think Blair is wrong, and contributing to the problem. I think he's being an ass-hole to be honest. Because he isn't being honest!
Here's why: (I purposely chose this from the headlined story at the Toronto Star, because is shows the massive gaps in logic being perpetrated, and how Blighty Whitey just don't get it, Mate. )
Make no mistake! As discussed with Zorro, there *IS* a massive problem! But to blame all Blacks, (which is *exactly* what Blair infers) is to blame all Whites for the faults of a few.
LONDON–Wading into one of the final controversies of his 10 years in power, British Prime Minister Tony Blair has ignited a fury by blaming a distinctive black culture for a rash of knife and gun crime in London since the start of the new year.
Admitting he was "lurching into total frankness" in his final weeks in office, Blair was quoted yesterday beneath a banner headline in The Guardian as saying the violence would not be stopped "by pretending it is not young black kids doing it."
Blair's remarks came during a lecture in Cardiff, Wales, where he downplayed poverty as a factor in a spree of teenage violence that has claimed the lives of seven young people since January.
"Economic inequality is a factor and we should deal with that, but I don't think it's the thing that is producing the most violent expression of this social alienation," Blair told reporters after the address.
"I think that is to do with the fact that particular youngsters are being brought up in a setting that has no rules, no discipline, no proper framework around them," Blair said.
"We need to stop thinking of this as a society that has gone wrong – it has not – but of specific groups that for specific reasons have gone outside of the proper lines of respect and good conduct towards others and need specific measures to be brought back into the fold."
Blair's comments were met with blanket condemnation from community leaders, who told the Toronto Star they felt "sideswiped" by the prime minister's suggestion that they alone bear responsibility for the issue. One accused Blair of "dishonestly attempting to absolve himself from the chronic lack of support for community efforts to create solutions."
"I am infuriated. Nobody in the black community is denying there is a problem. Even I acknowledge we have our `iffies.' We have a problem with our young kids, a very small minority of whom are out of control with knives and guns," said anti-gun campaigner Cheryl Sealey, co-ordinator of the London-based Victim Aid.
"But there is an entire catalogue of reasons for this violence and an entire catalogue of solutions. And Tony Blair, in the spirit and tone of his remarks, is completely ignoring the fact that his government has all but abandoned the community workers who are trying so hard to turn things around."
Blair said his controversial remarks were inspired by a recent conversation with a black pastor of a London church during a Downing Street summit on knife crime, who told him: "When are we going to start saying this is a problem amongst a section of the black community and not, for reasons of political correctness, pretend that this is nothing to do with it?"
Community activist Stafford Scott dismissed the comment, telling the Star: "Blair has made a career of surrounding himself with idiots, fools and sycophants who are all too ready to provide fodder for declarations designed for spin rather than substance.
"He is right that the so-called black community must take some responsibility. But the British leadership must also take some responsibility for creating this environment of continuing marginalization, which has been allowed to fester for decades." [...]
Blacks to blame for violence: Blair
Once again Tony opens his fat fugging mouth, and out comes shid. He's an insult! You start pointing fingers, Tony, and you'd damn-well best get it right. You've got it wrong! What else is new?
This is as honest as Iraqatak.
Can you ever get anything right, Tony?
Not *one* mention of Jamaica! This is a *SOCIAL* problem, not racial!
I think all politicians are crooks and should be shot. How does that feel, Tony? That is exactly what you state.
And since I'm in a pokey mood, Merlin, how in the hell can you lambaste me for taking other posters to task when you post absolutely racist diatribe drivel?
I seem to recollect your use of the term "sooties" some while back. Things never change, do they?
Blair has the awareness of a pile of shid. My apologies to the shid. What an azzhole....
You've just made the problem insolvable, Blair. What a winner you are. I'll hand you this, loser boy, it's as effective as Iraqatak, or any of the other multitude of misplays to your credit.
And here's from a Jamaican writer at the Toronto Star, an example of how not all Jamaicans fit the 'mould': (I've had extensive discussions with Jamaican friends on exactly this topic. Here's a very real irony: The 'troubles' are generational! This *did not happen* a generation ago! Where did Jamaica's youth go wrong? When Jamaican Rasta Music faded, and Hip-Hip, an *American influence* took hold. Hateful, despicable, and distinctly unfunky music. It's not even music to me. It's just hate for those that can't even tap their toes and dance, let alone put their caps on straight)
Bob Marley must be rolling in his grave.
Apr 14, 2007 02:30 AM
Royson James
"I learned more about my history in the last month than I did my entire life"
– A black broadcaster on the BBC, March 25, 2007.
Travelling the past two months between Toronto, Ghana and Britain has reminded me that we know precious little in Canada about the origins of our black citizens, and think about it even less.
Such is the virtual invisibility of their lives – crime reports notwithstanding – that blacks themselves know little about how they got to this country, their real names, and the genocidal historical forces that continue to shape their lives.
The fact that most blacks in the Americas, Europe and the Caribbean cannot trace their family tree beyond a few branches that end in a slave ship on the Atlantic speaks to this blotting out of a people, in history books and in our minds.
Here's what they taught me at school in Jamaica in the late 1950s and 1960s, even as America burned with racial upheaval, a few hours north: "Christopher Columbus discovered Jamaica in 1492. He arrived with the Nina and the Pinta."
The Arawaks and Caribs beat Columbus to the West Indian colonies. But I don't remember ever being asked to think about who they were or what happened to erase their very presence from the islands.
"Jamaica, Jamaica, Jamaica, land we love," we sang at independence in 1962. I was Jamaican. No thought of an ancestral home off the island; little word of slavery and life on the plantations – except oblique references to the Maroons and Cudjoe and the killing of Annie Palmer, the white witch of Rose Hall.
When Martin Luther King Jr. was shot in 1968, I got my first lessons in racism. I listened dumbfounded to radio clips of his speeches. Where had I been? Why didn't I know any of this?
The only exposure to Africa was not as the motherland but as the jungle, home to Tarzan and Jane, savages and witch doctors. And when I was about 19 and a fellow worker at Grand & Toy told me that there were glorious African kings and sophisticated African civilizations before the white man arrived, it threw me for a loop.
They didn't teach me that. They taught me about Vasco da Gama and the heroic pirates and Captain Morgan and Drake and the Queen. We celebrated our captors.
Independence brought a dramatic change in the curriculum. My younger cousins learned much more Jamaican history. The abolitionists Nanny of the Maroon and Sam Sharpe were celebrated, meaning the history of slavery was starting to be heard.
But Africa was still a foreign continent, not home, not Mama Africa – not until Bob Marley started drumming that into our consciousness.[...]
Why slavery era enchains us still
I know Ming will access it. I'd be surprised if anyone else did. It's too real....
The UK will get worsse until it faces up to reality. And Blair sure as hell ain't helpin' none.
So Merlin, I hear that they're gonna ship out all the Scots from England. Gonna ship them all back to Africa, where they were used as slaves, because they were useless as breeders for meat. |
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MingToo
| 14 Apr '07 23:40 : 0 recs
If they started the fire, then perhaps they should apologies. |
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zorro
| 14 Apr '07 23:36 : 0 recs : edited 1 time : last edit 14 Apr '07 23:37
Apologising for slavery: are we also in favour of the London Fire Brigade apologising for the fact that the fire in Pudding Lane in 1666 got out of hand?  |
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